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Post by The Sandmen on Mar 4, 2014 2:24:50 GMT -5
There are 2 issues people are currently having, and both involve a member who is as good at expressing himself as a limbless jaguar is at masturbating a dickless rhino.
Issue 1: The Expansion Draft
Since the site launched, we have given new members the option to build their teams either from the available fighters lists, or through requesting an expansion draft (whereby current teams protect some fighters and others can be drawn from for the new team, just like every other major sports league).
Apparently people did not read that, and now, 2 years later, it's a problem.
From a new-team perspective, it's a way for teams to get fighters they might like, while not touching the primary pieces of an existing team. Current teams keep most of their favourite guys, but MAYBE lose out on one or two guys of their choosing so a new member could enjoy the site.
So, some options:
a) Abolish Expansion and give new teams 10 Points, instead of the customary 2 points.
b) Keep Expansion and offer compensation points to teams losing a fighter (I would suggest 2 across the board to avoid complications)
c) Keep expansion exactly the way it is.
d) Something else someone comes up with in this thread to allow new members a piece of the fun.
Issue 2: Weight Class Changes
(this discussion is about long-term weight class changes, NOT catchweight fights, superfights, or Grand Prix fights)
Until now, I have offered weight class changes for applicable fighters at any time. They have been rarely used. The first change was moving dominant MW Anderson Silva up to harder competition at HW to allow other members a shot at the MW belt.
Within the simulator, this change is not simple. It requires a glitch-work-around. I have never had a problem doing it for people until recently.
When the idea of the Expansion draft came up, a member expressed the desire to use this weight class change as a means of protecting fighters within a certain weight class (of which he holds 4 former champions), thus circumventing the entire point of the Expansion draft. Through discussing this issue, it was brought to my attention that the sole reason this person wanted to move their fighter down in weight class was to get easy fights while upgrading their fighter before moving him back up again to a higher weight class.
Since the point of the weight class changes is supposed to be to give more fight options, and allow more fun for everyone, I feel this greatly ruins the fun of weight class changes.
So, some options:
a) Keep weight class changes whenever,
b) limit weight class changes to once per fighter (then it becomes permanent)
c) limit weight class changes to once per fighter per every 5 seasons
d) abolish weight class changes entirely - fighters stay where they are brought in to avoid scams
e) Something else someone comes up with in this thread to allow new members to have fun without scamming the system.
Let's hear it, folks. And please stay on topic. Off-topic bitching will most-certainly be deleted. I want solutions, not finger-pointing.
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Post by xx - Team GAP on Mar 4, 2014 7:56:42 GMT -5
Expansion draft: Abolish the expansion draft. It's not really needed. new teams can start up the same as most everyone else on this site has done.
Weight Class: weight class changes have been limited by saying you can only change to a weight class your fighter has already fought in, in RL. Let people change weight classes.. but to prevent people from flip flopping all the time.. only allowing a change every 3-5 seasons is fair. I do like the idea of allowing fighters to be put into a reserve category.. where you can have them apart of your team but they don't fight and you can just build them up so that fighters can train and they are not forced to ruin their records.
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Post by xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club on Mar 4, 2014 10:06:29 GMT -5
Abolish the Expansion Draft completely. No 10 points, just the standard 2 like everyone else that's entered the league before. No special treatment. Since we're already seeing that new fighters to the league are having as much success right off the bat as the the veteran fighters of the league. The parity gap is closing rapidly, no need to perpetually have it where there's always teams trying to catch up to everyone else. So therefore, obviously, if the expansion draft is kept, I also have no issue with folks changing fighters to an eligible weight class to protect them from the Expansion Draft, seeing as I already felt it was a useless function from when I arrived and not needed.
Now, with the weight class changes as a whole, I personally have no problem with fighters changing weight classes if they've fought in that weight class RL. Just means if their in any contention spot in Weight Class A and the switch, they drop down to the bottom of Weight Class B and have to work their way up again. Getting "easier fights" in a lower weight class isn't a concern of mine at all really, if the fighter is good, then he's going to be good at any weight class he's eligible for; we've already seen this with Anderson Silva where he was just as dominant at HW as he was at MW. The interesting one would be BJ Penn seeing as how he's fought at all 3 weight classes, he's one that might have a bit of a struggle at HW here, but I could see him being a formidable MW.
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Post by The Rocketmen on Mar 4, 2014 13:39:37 GMT -5
I'll continue to give new members a free fighter from my club, that is a perk they get on this site because I don't believe in hoarding talent.
If others don't want the expansion draft, then I say new members get 10 points because most of the fighters we don't have we don't have for a reason. It gives them a chance to come in and make an immediate mark as well as be exciting for them to instantly upgrade someone. Encourages posting for more points, etc.
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Post by The Sandmen on Mar 4, 2014 14:49:12 GMT -5
bump
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Post by xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club on Mar 4, 2014 15:12:33 GMT -5
I'll continue to give new members a free fighter from my club, that is a perk they get on this site because I don't believe in hoarding talent. If others don't want the expansion draft, then I say new members get 10 points because most of the fighters we don't have we don't have for a reason. It gives them a chance to come in and make an immediate mark as well as be exciting for them to instantly upgrade someone. Encourages posting for more points, etc. It's not about hoarding talent man... I'm willing to make trades, it's just that folks generally don't want the fighters I have. Which is fine, that's partly by design but it's also partly because of the limited talent pool I had to choose from when I came in. I didn't have the luxury of having a team quit just prior to me joining the site and there wasn't a plethora of talent like Team 3lite or the Bulldozers had to select from and I didn't wanna be the chump stain that took fighters from other teams; I just don't feel that's right. I had to draft and effectively purchase both of the champions that I've had. And I honestly scoff when I hear you say "I'll continue to give new members a free fighter from my club, that is a perk they get on this site" but I didn't receive that perk, as much as you'll swear up and down that you "tried to give" me Lesnar... I'm constantly seeing you trading away more upgraded, and in some cases, better fighters to other teams for less than what your asking price was for Lesnar and I still ended up getting ripped off for him in the sense that it was supposed to be a "new team/friendly/free fighter" deal, so I'm sorry if I'm a little sour and in disbelief when I see deals like you made for Coleman or Evans to other teams, that has been the major factor leading to my ideal of "no special treatment". I also disagree with giving new teams 10 points, and that's only because, as we've already seen this season, new fighters do come in now and make immediate marks with very little to no upgrades and they also start at 25 posts/point up, unless that's changed too. So many concessions have already been made for the lower posting teams and the new teams like when 3lite came in and Ramrod's entire team was being held for just that purpose, Bulldozers comes in and he's handed a champion on a silver platter, and if the teams are receiving that perk from you, then one has to ask, how much is enough? How many more concessions do you want to give new teams? We've still got currently active teams that are claiming they don't have the post volumes to generate points or upgrade their fighters, but we're now suggesting that we give new teams 10 points now to effectively put them ahead of those low posting teams? Does this really make allot of sense to you? Cuz it sure doesn't to me. |
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Post by The Rocketmen on Mar 4, 2014 15:31:02 GMT -5
How did my post all of a sudden become about you?
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Post by xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club on Mar 4, 2014 15:42:34 GMT -5
How did my post all of a sudden become about you? It didn't. When I give examples to back up a point I'm making, I usually use examples that have pertained to me in some way because it's what I do know to be fact as oppose to making speculative statements/comments and basing my points on skewed data that could in the end be slightly fabricated and not completely accurate. This way it's clean, concise and to the point. It's not meant to start a fight at all dude. |
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Post by The Sandmen on Mar 4, 2014 16:29:25 GMT -5
And I honestly scoff when I hear you say "I'll continue to give new members a free fighter from my club, that is a perk they get on this site" but I didn't receive that perk, as much as you'll swear up and down that you "tried to give" me Lesnar... So, you don't have Brock right now? INteresting. I will post the auction for him in a few hours, cause I thought you did. My mistake. |
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Post by The Sandmen on Mar 4, 2014 16:37:28 GMT -5
The other reason the expansion draft exists is because of league-wide fighter totals. Once we hit certain numbers, you will see your fighters fighting like, 1 or 2 times a year. With the expansion option, that kept our numbers level.
The other thing to consider is everyone here has been around for at least 1 auction (except Bulldozers, who was gifted a champion). That means everyone here has had a shot at some elite fighters. If someone else were to sign up now, the best fighter they have a hope in hell of acquiring outside of Rocketmen's charity is a 10th tier fighter everyone here has passed up on across 10 drafts.
The more I hear people's arguments here, the more I feel like there are only 2 people here capable of looking at the bigger picture, rather than putting ourselves first. That disappoints me.
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Post by xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club on Mar 4, 2014 18:42:10 GMT -5
And I honestly scoff when I hear you say "I'll continue to give new members a free fighter from my club, that is a perk they get on this site" but I didn't receive that perk, as much as you'll swear up and down that you "tried to give" me Lesnar... So, you don't have Brock right now? INteresting. I will post the auction for him in a few hours, cause I thought you did. My mistake. Read the rest of what I said there, not just use the parts that suit you to create a situation that wasn't there in the first place. This is exactly the type of stuff (pollution) that needs to stop Justin... So what happens to you when you're the cause of it? Do you get a warning too? I mean, you say this bullshit has to end, but you do nothing yourself to achieve that end. Take some initiative yourself bud. |
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Post by The Sandmen on Mar 4, 2014 19:39:37 GMT -5
So what happens to you when you're the cause of it? Do you get a warning too? Nope. That's the trade-off for building the site from the ground-up and investing literally 3-6 hours a day into this site over 2 years. Complete, and total immunity.  |
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Post by xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club on Mar 4, 2014 19:42:46 GMT -5
The other reason the expansion draft exists is because of league-wide fighter totals. Once we hit certain numbers, you will see your fighters fighting like, 1 or 2 times a year. With the expansion option, that kept our numbers level. The other thing to consider is everyone here has been around for at least 1 auction (except Bulldozers, who was gifted a champion). That means everyone here has had a shot at some elite fighters. If someone else were to sign up now, the best fighter they have a hope in hell of acquiring outside of Rocketmen's charity is a 10th tier fighter everyone here has passed up on across 10 drafts. The more I hear people's arguments here, the more I feel like there are only 2 people here capable of looking at the bigger picture, rather than putting ourselves first. That disappoints me. If you're actually including yourself in that group of two, you have serious problems man cuz for the one or two things you do, do "for league" you do about 5-6 for yourself that either go unnoticed or initially slip under the radar, then when you're called on it you say "Oh, too bad, so sad. It's too late." That is a serious problem that you need to address with yourself Justin. Cuz eventually folks are going to realize, much like Cannon has recently, that ol'Kruze really isn't as delusional as you and RocketMen try to spin him to be after all. That's just a fact. As for your actual points, at the rate we actually acquire new teams around here, we won't be hitting the level of fighters fighting 1-2 fights/season for a long time. Why keep a function that serves no current function nor has it ever been used? You're living in fear of a future number of league-wide fighters that will never likely ever be reached. As for Dozers not being a part of any auctions, that part is true, but if you look at his team, he actually did benefit from recent auctions with fighters like Carwin, Marquartdt, Johnson, Torres, Howe etc. available then on top of that being handed Coleman and Coenen by the RocketMen for basically nothing and also acquiring Valasquez & Faber under similar circumstances. And sure, everyone else hass had a SHOT at a top tier fighter through auction, but it took til the 2nd auction before I was able to acquire a top fighter through auction. But that's also not the entire reason that there's a lack of top tier fighters on either of the FA lists either. When we do an auction, it's a swap, so there's always a fighter going onto the list too, and their not always shitty fighters. But also, to the point of having more top tier fighters on the free agent lists, with the addition of your Soviet team, did that not diminish that list too? With name like A. Emelianenko & Schlemenko, etc. not available for these folks to draft anymore when new teams are created? You can sure throw the blame around to everything else, but adding that team didn't help with having some amazing talent remaining on those lists either. Now sure, you can point at my roster size and say that I'm "hoarding talent" if you want, but how many of the fighters on my team do you or anyone else actually want for their teams? 3 maybe 4, tops, out of 24? How is that hoarding top talent in the league when I truly only have 3-4 top tier fighters, and only 3 of which are former ManMMA champions; which really is no more "elite" talent than anyone else has on their teams. If you and RocketMen want to give charity deals to new teams, fill your boots... that's kool. But we've got a number of struggling teams already, or teams that feel like their struggling, and by allowing the Expansion draft, while it does strengthen the new team, it makes the rest of the teams in the league weaker by default and diminishing the experience for those teams that have been here and have spent time working on their fighters just to have them ripped away for nothing. I didn't think that was right before, and I still don't now. |
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Post by The Sandmen on Mar 4, 2014 19:51:30 GMT -5
Now sure, you can point at my roster size and say that I'm "hoarding talent" if you want, but how many of the fighters on my team do you or anyone else actually want for their teams? That is what the expansion option would determine. Everyone would be given a fair number of protects to keep who they wanted, and the new team could take fighters they WANTED. It's not just about winning, it's about having guys you want. If I just found this site today, there is literally no one available I would want. So I would not join, as there would be no fun. Even if someone offered me Cain Velasquez or Jon Fitch or Demetrius Johnson. Those are GOOD fighters, but not people that interest me. The expansion option has been implemented to give people a better pool to draw from when joining up. If there is no one on your team that anyone wants, then you have nothing to worry about with the Expansion option. |
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Post by xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club on Mar 4, 2014 19:56:05 GMT -5
So what happens to you when you're the cause of it? Do you get a warning too? Nope. That's the trade-off for building the site from the ground-up and investing literally 3-6 hours a day into this site over 2 years. Complete, and total immunity. That's no trade off. That's bullshit and abuse of power. If you're part of the cause of allot the bullshit that's been happening, as you've just admitted finally (thank you), then if you want the pollution to stop, why would you not curb your own behavior to not continue the spread of that bullshit? All it really seems to me like is you really only want folks like myself, Cannon, and GAP to stop defending ourselves against you so that you and RocketMen can continue to antagonize, troll and effectively bully us without any resistance. And if we don't allow you to do that, then we'll be banned. That's pretty lame dude. |
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