WRESTLING ISNT WRESTLING

[xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club]

[The Sandmen]

Stop posting videos from your phone. They are not working.

[xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club]

Apr 20, 2015 20:46:12 GMT -5 The Sandmen said:

Stop posting videos from your phone. They are not working.

I dunno why they're not now... they were before.

[The Sandmen]

Donno, but none of them in the past like, 2-3 days have done anything, so it looks like you are posting blank posts on our end.

[xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club]

I did accidently hit the desktop version button the other day and had a helluva time getting back to the.mobile version... wonder if that had something to do with it?!

[The Sandmen]

I donno. But it seems anything you post that starts with a m.youtube is not embedding.

[The West Coast Knockouts]

The fear of top guys going to WCW was dead by the end of 1998 because that was when WCW started having money problems. So that totally kills your argument about guys being pushed fast, because "top" guys would go over to WCW. When WWE got WCW and ECW they had the deepest roster ever and this isn't just my opinion . So WWE had no reason to push Lesnar , Cena and Orton but Rock started hinting he was leaving for Hollywood and Stone Cold's neck problems were catching up to him . Hence why those three were called up . Batista was actually part of that group but he is older than them that's why I left him out lol



And Like you said that was completely different era .So saying Sami Zayn is to be a star in wwe from the age of 34 to 54 is highly unlikely . Problem with WWE right now is it has no depth like they did in the 2000's. The content is terrible to watch .... You see the same matches week after week. Only part of WWE worth watching right now is the beginning and Ending of Raw.Smackdown is completely irrelevant now lol it's basically matches you watched on raw with the same superstars.


You brought up guys like maven but look at today's roster and you'll see the mavens and Luther Reigns's ( Adam Rose , Big E , Luke Harper etc) . And Yeah it's great your bringing up names from the past like Flair and sting . But ask yourself this . should WWE be really be bringing legends like sting to bolster the wrestlemaina card every year when you claim the quality of its current wrestlers are off the charts ? If WWE really waited till its wrestlers were ready like you are saying then why is roman reigns up on the main roster being pushed to the max? When he clearly isn't even close to being ready .

There's a lot of things wrong with WWE right now and I understand your going to support them and watch their garbage but ever since 2010 WWE's decent product went from pretty good to crap . Other than the rise of CM Punk , Daniel Bryan and obviously seeing Rock and Lesnar return part time . Which reminds me , Why is Lesnar being paid a full time top spot salary by WWE for the next how many years if WWE is in such a good place with its development ?

[xx - Camp Cannon]

yeah they saidd they dont want anyone over 49 50 (exception undertaker 1 more wrestlemania)competing cause someone had a heart attack think it was ric flair vs shawn micheals not really sure tho

[xx - The Underdog Regime]

Apr 21, 2015 0:01:35 GMT -5 The West Coast Knockouts said:

The fear of top guys going to WCW was dead by the end of 1998 because that was when WCW started having money problems. So that totally kills your argument about guys being pushed fast, because "top" guys would go over to WCW. When WWE got WCW and ECW they had the deepest roster ever and this isn't just my opinion . So WWE had no reason to push Lesnar , Cena and Orton but Rock started hinting he was leaving for Hollywood and Stone Cold's neck problems were catching up to him . Hence why those three were called up . Batista was actually part of that group but he is older than them that's why I left him out lol



And Like you said that was completely different era .So saying Sami Zayn is to be a star in wwe from the age of 34 to 54 is highly unlikely . Problem with WWE right now is it has no depth like they did in the 2000's. The content is terrible to watch .... You see the same matches week after week. Only part of WWE worth watching right now is the beginning and Ending of Raw.Smackdown is completely irrelevant now lol it's basically matches you watched on raw with the same superstars.


You brought up guys like maven but look at today's roster and you'll see the mavens and Luther Reigns's ( Adam Rose , Big E , Luke Harper etc) . And Yeah it's great your bringing up names from the past like Flair and sting . But ask yourself this . should WWE be really be bringing legends like sting to bolster the wrestlemaina card every year when you claim the quality of its current wrestlers are off the charts ? If WWE really waited till its wrestlers were ready like you are saying then why is roman reigns up on the main roster being pushed to the max? When he clearly isn't even close to being ready .

There's a lot of things wrong with WWE right now and I understand your going to support them and watch their garbage but ever since 2010 WWE's decent product went from pretty good to crap . Other than the rise of CM Punk , Daniel Bryan and obviously seeing Rock and Lesnar return part time . Which reminds me , Why is Lesnar being paid a full time top spot salary by WWE for the next how many years if WWE is in such a good place with its development ?

1. Yes, 1998, the same year where WCW was in the lead in ratings, had the bigger name talent and outdrew the Federation in a regular basis. This ruins your counter-argument right there.
Once the Federation bought out WCW and ECW, sure, they were getting new talent. HOWEVER, they needed to mold them into the WWF system, which is completely different from the systems in either promotions. This is why they needed to bring in the developmental talent such as Cena, Lesnar, Orton, and Batista. They were groomed in the WWF system since they are in OVW. Again, you can't say that developmental is the same that it is today. They're gonna take time to groom these guys into making them a WWE system guy instead of the ROH talent or TNA talent. For Christ's sake, this is a different time in the wrestling business. It's gonna take time to mold the people you want to make into superstars, especially when they're transitioning from professional wrestling to the 'sports entertainment' model. It was the same after the Brand Extension, and it's still the same today.

2. Sure, we could go into the problem of the lack of roster depth for the WWE. But, wasn't it the exact same in the 80s? I mean, aside from Hogan and Savage, who really cared about anybody else on the main roster? There is a cycle when it comes to wrestling, their fanbase and the roster talent. I mean, as of right now, we have an exact replica to the 80s right now. We have a few main eventers, and then a good list of mid-cards, followed by a list of nobodies.

3. I'm going to mainly ignore a bunch of that paragraph there just because you're really using Roman Reigns as an example of 'people being pushed to the max'. This is the problem that I have with the so-called hardcore fans and the people who just all of a sudden decide "Hey, Roman is being pushed. We should be in outrage", despite Roman being pushed since he debuted, and nobody had a problem with him being the runner-up to the 2014 Rumble, and making established guys like Rey Mysterio and others look like sandbags at the Survivor Series. Oh, all because the Federation wants to try to give Roman a chance, and giving him a Wrestlemania title shot, everyone is up in arms. I mean, come the fuck on. They do this with a lot of people. Look at Del Rio in 2011, look at Lesnar (even already established at this point) in 2003. There have been guys that have been pushed way harder than Roman Reigns, and now all of a sudden it's not right. Well, I bet the federation is sorry for trying to push new talent, which is what THE ENTIRE WRESTLING FANBASE HAVE BEEN ASKING FOR. This entire paragraph is trying to explain why the roster isn't strong enough to support a Wrestlemania card, even though this year's Wrestlemania (You know, all 7 matches) was considered a huge success with the roster they have right now. Give me a break.

4. "Other than the rise of CM Punk , Daniel Bryan and obviously seeing Rock and Lesnar return part time ."
Yes, don't mention the establishment of Ambrose, Rollins, Reigns, Bray Wyatt, and all the new talent you see today, because they aren't making the product any better apparently. Again, a problem with the hardcore fans is that they stick with a guy who has left the company for good and a very good wrestler who doesn't have the proper mic skills to support a feud by himself without going 'YES! YES! YES!' all the time. Sure, it's a gimmick, which everyone needs, but it's not really a gimmick that has lasted too long (I mean, look at how quiet the yes chants have become). How about looking at the future talent we have, and instead of looking at this as 'Oh god, we're doomed because we don't have The Rock and Austin anymore, and it now makes us doomed. Oh no!', look at this as a time for a rebuild. It's gonna get better, and it will take time.
As for Lesnar, Brock brings in new fans from places that other wrestlers can't, as well as sponsorship opportunities, endorsements, and other deals. He is a human money making machine ever since he decided to take his talents to the UFC. He is a huge name in the sports business, and guys like Bryan, Punk, hell even Cena couldn't bring in the same money that Brock could. And, while the developmental talent are learning the 'sports entertainment model', Lesnar can fill in, become the fed's champion, and bring in money. Simple as that.





NOTE: This is a lot of me in a very stressed mood (dorm related), and it may seem like a 'heat of the moment' thing, but I'm just sick and tired of seeing and hearing people say that the WWE is doomed and it won't come back to their glory days. It's a fucking cycle, they'll get back to their better side soon enough. Give it some fucking time.

[The Rocketmen]

I agree with the cycle. And I hope it does come back around. I'm just being patient, because I'd love for it to return to an attitude era.

[xx - Former Phoenix Fight Club]

Apr 21, 2015 8:02:46 GMT -5 The Rocketmen said:

I agree with the cycle. And I hope it does come back around. I'm just being patient, because I'd love for it to return to an attitude era.

Well, I don't think we'll ever see a return of the Attitude era per se, unfortunately, since they are playing to more of a pre-teen/adolescent oriented market again. Which is kind of funny because in the day and age we live in now, we see far worse on regular primetime television than anything that was ever broadcast in the Attitude era. Though I think this lull in.the cycle again is simply just an Attitude era hangover. They went mainstream during that time period and it wasn't just Hulk Hogan that was a household name anymore. They peaked, but still maintain a large and loyal fanbase from those years and they still put out a far superior product than TNA does, despite having a decidedly weaker talent pool than in previous decades.

[The Mighty Ducks]

I will wrestler and become gigantic in the public eye and save the federation.

You're welcome!

[The Sandmen]

Apr 21, 2015 6:04:47 GMT -5 xx - The Underdog Regime said:

NOTE: This is a lot of me in a very stressed mood (dorm related), and it may seem like a 'heat of the moment' thing, but I'm just sick and tired of seeing and hearing people say that the WWE is doomed and it won't come back to their glory days. It's a fucking cycle, they'll get back to their better side soon enough. Give it some fucking time.

For starters, I want to say I tihnk they will be okay. But, I don't think they will get back to their glory days. They have a monopoly, and without any sort of direct, legit competition, fringe fans now have the option to turn AWAY from wrestling, rather than to an alternate product. There was A LOT of excitement back in the Monday Night Wars days about losing or gaining talent from the other side, and that is something that is pretty much lost forever now. WWE is great and all, but it's all there is for wrestling. That, or old stuff. So despite being a huge fan of WRESTLING, I just don't see what I am looking for in the WWE anymore on a consistent basis, so I do Wrestlamania annually, and basically watch old stuff.

Without viable competition to keep things fresh and edgy, (and with a long of strange, strange Vince-decisions in the early 2000s), I was able to transition to MMA, which I (usually) find far more exciting. They need to understand that to bring people like me back I want less of the old shit I have already seen (Bored of Triple H, bored of Undertaker, Bored of Nash, Hall, Hogan, The Rock, and every McMahon). Keep the new, exciting, electrifying talent like Bryan coming. When I tune in at 'Mania, and see someone like that, I actually think about watching again on Monday. Triple H burying Sting for no reason other than jacking off his ego makes me content to watch once a year, and reassures me I made the right decision abandoning my passion and dedication for the product when I did.

[The West Coast Knockouts]

1998 ? Do your research. WCW kicked wwe in ratings from 95 to 97 . They were in the lead for a couple months in 98 but after that WWE took off and did not look back .

"Once the Federation bought out WCW and ECW, sure, they were getting new talent. HOWEVER, they needed to mold them into the WWF system, which is completely different from the systems in either promotions. This is why they needed to bring in the developmental talent such as Cena, Lesnar, Orton, and Batista. They were groomed in the WWF system since they are in OVW."

No offense but that's a stupid explanation .Chris Jericho and Big show were brought right In to WWE when the ditched WCW before it sank . Why weren't they sent to development if they were not trained in the wwe way ? . Many of the guys WWE brought in from WCW like Benoit , Eddie , Chavo , Bookie T and Rey Mysterio etc and from ECW RVD and others . They either international experience or were seasoned In wrestling and knew what they had to do . So why would that be reason to call up younger guys when WWE had a ton of depth ?

I have no problem with Pushing people but make it organic . Don't just shove it down people's throats . they are making Reigns invincible. Any match he fights in you know he is going to win . Reigns was already the chosen one since NXT. He was and still is being put in positions to succeed. Guys like John Cena ,Daniel Bryan and CM Punk who the crowd got behind became fan favorites organically . WWE needs to learn you can't just pick someone and tell the fans hey ! You will like him !. The fans gotta choose and right now it's Daniel Bryan .

Only Established guys right now other than John Cena that are going to be here for a while are Daniel Bryan ( if he can stay healthy) , Seth Rollins and Bray Wyatt . Ambrose and Reigns still a have a long ways to go .

Are you actually ripping Daniel Bryan ? Lmao !! Daniel Bryan doesn't have Mic skills ? ... good lord . This guy is so blind . Daniel Bryan is better than Roman Reigns when it comes to speaking ,wrestling and interacting with the fans. Reason why everyone likes him is he worked his ass off and become a success through hard work and dedication. He's a small town kid from Washington state who made it big with no help. He wasn't part of a wrestling clan like Reigns is . Aside from wrestling he's an inspiration to many . You may be big or small or poor but if you keep going hard towards your goal no matter how crazy it is .You will make it .That is why I cheer for Daniel Bryan and also why Millions across the globe do. The Yes movement is still going strong even though WWE is trying to bury Daniel in the mid card to push Reigns . You saw what happened at the Royal Rumble right ?

This years wrestlemaina was pretty bad imo , personally I like last year's better . Last year's had a lot more stories to tell this year's was thrown together quickly because WWE had no better ideas. I'm not the only one that thinks that

Lesnar is part time . He only shows up the Royal Rumble , Wrestlemaina and Summer Slam. So basically if your just watching WWE because of Lesnar you tune in when those PPV's are close. Other than that your just going to back to watching MMA and other stuff .

On the "hardcore fans " your Damn right we are vocal . We want wants best and not some mediocre crap some former writer from Hollywood is feeding to Vince McMahon. Raw used to be fun to watch but now it just puts me to sleep. Don't get me wrong I still love WWE ,I've been to two live events in the past 10 months in Abbotsford , I still read rumors and gossips every day. But Im tired of how stale and predictable its gotten.

[xx - The Underdog Regime]

Apr 21, 2015 20:47:28 GMT -5 The West Coast Knockouts said:

1998 ? Do your research. WCW kicked wwe in ratings from 95 to 97 . They were in the lead for a couple months in 98 but after that WWE took off and did not look back

*sigh* When people don't know their information.



In 1998, WCW DOMINATED during January, February and March in the ratings, held even through April and May, then came back to lead the ratings through August and September. The WWE didn't technically break through and start dominating until JANUARY 4TH, 1999 (5.7 to 5.0, then the 2.0 rating gap the following weeks to come). So, through 1998, WCW still had a pretty good stranglehold over the Fed in 1998, especially with the emergence and growing popularity that was Goldberg.

The other part of TL;DR in that post, not regarding the fact that it's a cycle and we're basically back to the 80s perspective in terms of product, talent and ratings, doesn't really matter anymore. But, I do want to show you something that you pointed out.

Apr 21, 2015 20:47:28 GMT -5 The West Coast Knockouts said:

Chris Jericho and Big show were brought right In to WWE when the ditched WCW before it sank . Why weren't they sent to development if they were not trained in the wwe way ? . Many of the guys WWE brought in from WCW like Benoit , Eddie , Chavo , Bookie T and Rey Mysterio etc and from ECW RVD and others

Uh...huh

Jericho - Never really established as Championship material until 2008, when he adopted the more serious moniker. He would never be champion with the WCW Model
Show - Gave him a chance, gave him the title at Survivor Series '99, then realized that nobody really liked him, and gave the belt to HHH the next night. Hasn't established as championship material really ever, despite him having WWECW and World Heavyweight title reigns.
Benoit - Was given one six-month reign as champion. After about 2 months, the crowd reception of him was extremely mild, put the title on Orton to develop a 'dissolution of Evolution' storyline. Never became a main-eventer again.
Eddie - It took him 3 years to become WWE Champion. He needed to learn how to actually be charismatic with the fans, and he needed to learn the different mindset.
Chavo - Seriously? Do I need to say anything else?
Booker - Never won a world title until he was King Booker, another WWE product. Sure, he had a match with H at Mania 19, but nobody remembers it.
Rey - It took him 4 years to get to Main Event status, and even then, he was booked as the worst World Champion ever. He lost all of his matches when he was World Champ! He never got back to those times again.
RVD - It took him 5 years to grab the WWE title, then he got out and smoked weed with Sabu and got arrested, which led to a spiral down the card, getting buried by Edge, and never getting another worthwhile world title shot in the company again.

You see a pattern here? People who came from other companies had to take LOADS OF TIME to adopt the WWE system, and even change their gimmick before ever getting close to the Main Event card and holding a presigious title for their company.

The rest? Very IWC-esque. The whole 'Oh, Bryan is so good, Reigns sucks. Nobody is getting pushed, the wrong guy is getting pushed. Too many part-timers. Ugh.'. Not even gonna regard it because it's what every short-sighted IWC fan posts on the forums. It's too bad it's poisoned your brain, too.